[jdull99]

https://racer.com/2024/12/04/toyota-...r-2025-season/

How safe is it that they will stay in midgets??? (They certainly have "helped" turn "National" midget racing into a professional series - at least for the multiple crew members...and the big owners appear to be sticking around...). - we are already debating on another thread about the series without them...


This guy retired earlier this year, & it made me wonder if there were big changes ahead...

https://www.motorsport.com/nascar-cu...ason/10642896/

[Charles Nungester]

Midgets weren't a professional racing sport 30yrs ago? I guess that wasn't Gordon, Stewart, Vogler etc racing the domes. Eldora, Thursday Night Thunder. In fact it was bigger 70yrs ago. When it was common or some racers to race five or six nights a week.

[Grocery Guy]

I am just a casual fan of NHRA. I'm sure the experts here can answer. What part of or on a Top Fuel or Funny Car is a Toyota? Is it just the marketing? Hard to picture a Toyota Camry funny car body resemblance. I agree, it's sad to see any big-time sponsor leave motorsports.

[diversified]

Manufacturer support is mainly in the area of aerodynamics for the funny car bodies, wind tunnel time, engineering support, data acquisition and the like.

[jdull99]

Originally Posted by Charles Nungester Midgets weren't a professional racing sport 30yrs ago? I guess that wasn't Gordon, Stewart, Vogler etc racing the domes. Eldora, Thursday Night Thunder. In fact it was bigger 70yrs ago. When it was common or some racers to race five or six nights a week.

That is why I didn't mention "drivers". - The teams those guys were driving for 30 / (I'll say "plus" since Vogler sadly wasn't here in 1994; and Jeff was out of midgets, but I get what you are saying) 30plus years ago were mainly one car, sometimes expanding to two car teams. Rollie had a great operation; but what were the details behind the scenes? Sure Lewis had Bob East, but what kind of operation was Ralph Potters (a good one, that I know, but were people employed to primarily look after that car)? I gathered Vogler did much of the crew work himself, but did he have paid help too? Wilke's, Gamester's, and Streicher's appeared to be family run teams that usually just had the one and sometimes two cars out there. Was there ever a time when there was this many multiple car teams that appear to have full time crew members on them? Sure, in the later 90s you had Lewis expanding, Pete W came in with Kunz, CED team, etc; though; but, was there ever this much OEM style "support" (on whatever level this TRD deal really is)? Suppose Ford with Lewis possibly?

[Grocery Guy]

Originally Posted by diversified Manufacturer support is mainly in the area of aerodynamics for the funny car bodies, wind tunnel time, engineering support, data acquisition and the like.

Thank you. I wondered where their funding went. Clearly that's important information. Thanks for letting me and others know.

[jdull99]

Originally Posted by jdull99 That is why I didn't mention "drivers". - The teams those guys were driving for 30 / (I'll say "plus" since Vogler sadly wasn't here in 1994; and Jeff was out of midgets, but I get what you are saying) 30plus years ago were mainly one car, sometimes expanding to two car teams. Rollie had a great operation; but what were the details behind the scenes? Sure Lewis had Bob East, but what kind of operation was Ralph Potters (a good one, that I know, but were people employed to primarily look after that car)? I gathered Vogler did much of the crew work himself, but did he have paid help too? Wilke's, Gamester's, and Streicher's appeared to be family run teams that usually just had the one and sometimes two cars out there. Was there ever a time when there was this many multiple car teams that appear to have full time crew members on them? Sure, in the later 90s you had Lewis expanding, Pete W came in with Kunz, CED team, etc; though; but, was there ever this much OEM style "support" (on whatever level this TRD deal really is)? Suppose Ford with Lewis possibly?

&, let's say it like this (taking away who gets paid to do what and who is paying who whatever); but; I'd have to think the amount of cars that make every show is near its highest ever? "Back in the day"; teams (and certainly drivers) would miss races; due to distance, parts availably, and the simple fact that USAC scheduled on top of eachother - like in 95, Tony had to miss some in sprints and midgets and still won all 3 titles (I'd like to know when was the last year USAC did that).

So in some ways, I just feel USAC midgets (maybe even add in Xtreme, but there is not a lot of history there) is in some respects in its best version itself; but in other aspects, at a point not everyone thinks is good or as it should be (like more how it used to be: family led, blue collar teams; in a stall beside a muffler shop, behind a factory, paper company, etc - yes there are some of them out there though still, and they have won); but it seems to me this is the most multi car teams making most or all of the races with the largest number of compensated crew guys. Take it for good or bad.

To me, it looks like a version of the WoO. Bring 16-18 GOOD quality cars to an event, most in big rigs with all the mentioned. Take it for what it is worth; good or bad, but it is certainly an impressive version of itself. WoO has sustained itself for a pretty long time.

As far as Xtreme, their winning payouts (maybe thru the field) is some of the highest #s in National midget history. And, many USAC purses have risen too, but for sure the championship fund. How much of all that TRD helped or hurt, I do not know for sure.

[captrat]

I would like to return to that time when it was small teams. As much as possible remove factory support. We often hear about escalating costs. Much of this is driven by the the influence of factory money. It goes much deeper than just the technology it also infects the opportunities for drivers not affiliated with factory teams. Perhaps the Badger model is the one to aspire to,but big money whether it is engines or tires has the ear of sanctioning bodies and some competitors.